Which comes first: The body or the pan?

Big_kid · Post by **Big_kid** » Sat Dec 17, 2011 2:37 pm

Since the blue buggy is mostly legal (no inspection yet), my thoughts have started to turn toward the yellow buggy that's been waiting patiently behind the shed. This is a full length Tuff Tub, going on a '70 chassis.

The body does need some attention and eventually paint before being assembled. The pan needs floors and to be converted from autostick to 4 speed. The question is, which comes first? On the one hand I don't want a freshly painted body to sit outside while the pan gets done. On the other hand the same is true of the pan.

Thoughts/opinions?

williamblanda · Post by **williamblanda** » Sat Dec 17, 2011 3:32 pm

The chicken came first. Shoot, wrong question...

From other builds I've seen, the pan gets redone first. You can drive it around without the body too!

Big_kid · Post by **Big_kid** » Sat Dec 17, 2011 3:57 pm

But where did the chicken come from? And what did the chicken do with the pan while the body was getting it's share of the love?

Brown · Post by **Brown** » Sat Dec 17, 2011 5:30 pm

Big_kid wrote:But where did the chicken come from? And what did the chicken do with the pan while the body was getting it's share of the love?

Do the pan first, paint it with POR 15 then cover it with a tarp. That's what i've done. Now the pan is under anothet body that i ahd to same space in the driveway. Alos no one is going to see the pan!!!

volksbugusa · Post by **volksbugusa** » Sat Dec 17, 2011 6:21 pm

Por 15 is a great product as long as it has rust to adhere to. If you have no rust then use a black finish or rustoleum .Then once Por 15 is applied you need to top coat the finish....wear gloves and a respirator
matt

Big_kid · Post by **Big_kid** » Sat Dec 17, 2011 7:20 pm

I think the pan will be first. I was thinking along the same lines, once I started to think that is. I'll have to double check but I think the body only has 1 crack and a few small holes to fill. I can knock that out in a day once it warms up again. The biggest challenge will be getting the garage & the shed cleaned out of all the crap I'd been saving "for the buggy/camper" so I can get these cars inside them.

Next question-
It's going to sound dumb at this point, but will an arc welder work on the pans, or should I work out a deal with my buddy the welder? It's been a LONG time since I welded on a regular basis, 13 years since last time I picked one up at all.

Brown · Post by **Brown** » Sat Dec 17, 2011 10:31 pm

I used a Mig Welder for my pans, and have only had a little experience with an arc welder but think you might have trouble controlling the burn through since the pans are very thin.

Big_kid · Post by **Big_kid** » Sat Dec 17, 2011 11:03 pm

Burn through is something I'd thought about, I think I'll get up with my buddy the welder. While I'm at it I'll see if he (or anyone else) has an opinion of pan halves vs flat sheet metal. My blue buggy has sheet metal installed by the previous owner, and it worked out well for me.

AoT · Post by **AoT** » Sat Dec 17, 2011 11:12 pm

Big_kid wrote:
Thoughts/opinions?

Like your motivation Charlie!!

Big_kid · Post by **Big_kid** » Sun Dec 18, 2011 10:01 am

Just trying to learn form the experience of anyone else who has been there before me, or who has relevant info. It's a LOT cheaper and faster that way!

Big_kid · Post by **Big_kid** » Sun May 05, 2013 9:10 pm

Update- I gave this buggy to my BIL last fall. He bought pans, my buddy welded them in, and then it sat. Short version: Another buddy gave my BIL what he had into the pans, and we towed it over to his house. I'm determined to see this thing built one way or another! My only regret was being "that guy" for so long. It sat for 10 years while I had it. I'm hoping to help get it to Manx on the Banx this year.

Raj · Post by **Raj** » Sun May 05, 2013 10:39 pm

So is the blue buggy back with you now?

Big_kid · Post by **Big_kid** » Mon May 06, 2013 7:22 am

Blue buggy never left me, this is the yellow one that once was my sig pic.

VwJay · Post by **VwJay** » Mon May 06, 2013 9:32 am

I would always do the chassis first. That way, even if you don't do any cosmetic work to the body it can still be assembled and driven. With the opportunity to make it pretty at a later date. Just like building a house, foundation first.

Big_kid · Post by **Big_kid** » Mon May 06, 2013 9:59 pm

Agreed. Looking back, it's how my blue buggy was done(I bought it as a body on a rolling chassis). That's how this yellow buggy ended up being done too. New pans, now it's at my buddy's house for the rest. I can't wait to see what he does with the paint & body- he runs a Chevy dealer's body shop.

Big_kid · Post by **Big_kid** » Tue Sep 17, 2013 11:13 pm

I've got an ignorant question here relating to the pressure plate/throwout bearing in this formerly yellow buggy. It's midnight & I'm half asleep, but if I've understood correctly we need either a sleeve in the bearing OR a ring on the PP, but not both, and not neither, correct? IIRC the transaxle does NOT have the sleeve, and I don't remember seeing a ring on the PP. Naturally the engine has been installed, but luckily the body has not. We got a kit, but the new clutch disc would NOT fit in there so we installed the disc that was on the engine when we got it. We'll be pulling the engine soon to get this sorted out, I was hoping to have a clear mental image of what I should be seeing.

In other news, the chassis was OSFO'ed & lined, new brakes, lines & MC, new ball joints (PITA!) clutch tube welded in, autostick swapped with a 4 speed (from a fastback, maybe?), body has been repaired, prepped & painted and is waiting for it's turn to be put on the pan. This thing is gonna turn some heads once it's on the road. Manx on the Banx is still a possibility for it the week of 10/14-18.

Big_kid · Post by **Big_kid** » Mon Sep 23, 2013 7:42 pm

Latest on the buggy formerly seen as yellow:
Went to the local Pick N Pull & pulled an engine & transaxle out of a 74/75 Beetle. My buddy Matt (who now owns this buggy) had been informed that a Fastback trans would not work and we needed a Beetle tranny. I'd recalled reading that the gearing was a little bit different, but otherwise it would work. Either way, we were having trouble. We got the engine & tranny home to find a brand new flywheel, clutch, pressure plate & throwout bearing in there, no ring, transaxle sleeve in place. We decided to try moving the sleeve & associated parts to the trans we'd already installed and seeing what that got us. It got us a running buggy! My guess on the naysayers is that the T3 tranny isn't the same length as the beetle, and would then put the engine in the wrong spot for the tin to line up properly. In an open buggy however, this is a non-issue.

The body was set on the pan for a test fit/alignment/weld in some pan supports and is likely coming back off soon(if it hasn't already). Hoping to get the brakes adjusted & a final bleed, body on & wired this weekend or as close to it as we can. Manx on the Banx is a possibility. So long as I can keep getting over there to help out, we might just make it. Fingers crossed...

Raj · Post by **Raj** » Tue Sep 24, 2013 6:27 am

pics pics pics!

Big_kid · Post by **Big_kid** » Tue Sep 24, 2013 6:22 pm

I don't have a lot of pics, but I'll post some of what I've got.

Engine, the day before it came to life. That motorcycle battery in the pic just didn't' have what it takes anymore.

VW ball joints are a PITMFA! Came out in pieces... but it has 4 new ones now.

New axles, new tranny mounts, new pans, Osfo'ed & bedlined, new tires on all 4 too (after this pic)

It isn't yellow anymore. Teaser pic... I'll let Matt post the debut. He's been on theSamba here & there, don't want to steal his thunder. It's getting closer. He got a box o'wire for it, I think we'll be tackling that soon. Getting mine back on the road will be motivation & reference material.

The pan was an autostick, and did NOT have a clutch tube. A few cuts & welds later, it has one.

Kinda nasty in there, but we cleaned it out with a vacuum & an air compressor.

Where he welded the tube in the rear:

Up front (Should have kept it open until after the pedal cluster & cables were in for the last time):

Osfo'ed pans & opened tunnel:

I haven't seen this in person since I was a little_kid in Coram. He needed the motivation & the grin factor it provided:

Raj · Post by **Raj** » Tue Sep 24, 2013 6:37 pm

Big_kid wrote:[/url]

love this!

Post by **ObnoxiousBlue** » Tue Sep 24, 2013 7:50 pm

Big_kid wrote:

Man! That's fun! I drove Ken's chassis around the Community Center in Port Jeff for LIAR 1 in 2011... What a blast that was!

Big_kid · Post by **Big_kid** » Wed Sep 25, 2013 7:13 am

I saw the pics, that's why I wrote "in person". My brother did this with his fastback when i was little, we rode through the woods a time or two before he built a trike with it.

VwJay · Post by **VwJay** » Wed Sep 25, 2013 10:50 am

I use to do that with my 70 all the time. Learned how to drive a manual that way. But I was a little more daring having only vise grips on the steering box. No column. Was a few years before the body was back on. Ah memories.......

Raj · Post by **Raj** » Wed Sep 25, 2013 4:00 pm

VwJay wrote: Ah memories.......

lol... ah yes.... when we were young dumb and full of.... ummmm... never mind.

Big_kid · Post by **Big_kid** » Wed Sep 25, 2013 10:46 pm

full of.... stupid ideas?

Yeah, that's it. At least that's my story & I'm stickin' to it.

Das Volks Vintage Volkswagen Gruppe

Which comes first: The body or the pan?

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